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Discussion Starter #1
Has anyone taken the internals and lower tubes from a ZX14 and inserted them into the outer tubes of the 12 forks? I'm wondering if this would be easily accomplished like changing fork seals. This would allow for newer internals AND give the biggest benefit of radial calipers--the cast radial mount. The adaptors allow one to use radial calipers on a non-radial fork but it doesn't give the best benefit--the actual radial mount.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I agree but after several search attempts, I have noticed 04-05 12 forks are much harder to come by than 14 forks. There are brand new 14 forks with headsets for less than $400 on ebay right now. This is what prompted my question. They are both 43mm and should be the same length but I'm not sure if the bleed holes are in the same locations.
 

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I also have wondered if that was possible....
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
I did some checking and found something pretty interesting...if you need to replace pitted, scratched, or dented inner fork tubes, you can buy new OEM ones with the brake mount for a 04/05 bike with radial brakes for about $375 each. If any of you have priced replacement tubes from Race Tech, you know that they run from $185-$350 (depending on the coating you want) and they don't include the brake/wheel mount. When I replaced the springs & seals and installed Gold Valves last winter, I noticed my inner tubes were pitted toward the bottom and figured I'd have to replace them on the next rebuild.
 

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Mine have some corrosion where they are hidden by the front fender and are due a rebuild. Very interested to know if you come to a conclusion with this. I don't like re-chroming fork inners, never thought of new OEM inners.:headscratch:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
In all likeliness, I won't have a good reason for doing this until next winter, when another fork service is in order. Unfortunately, the outer fork bushings aren't replaceable and are only obtained by replacing the outer tubes (the bushings come installed in the tubes). I priced new outer tubes at $598 each (ouch)! The funny thing is that a pair of fully assembled, new OEM forks can be purchased for a little over $1400--that's way less than buying the inner and outer tubes for both sides--and that's without internals or fork caps. Considering all this, I wish I had purchased a pair of Ohlins for $1600 (clearance) when I had the chance. All of this is to say that I hope the bushings don't show signs of wear on the next service because it will get expensive if they do.

On the plus side, calipers, even new ones, are pretty cheap. Brand new calipers for the current generation 10 can be had for $230 each and used on eBay for around $75 each. The downside of going used is that unless they were removed almost unused, it would be best to change the pads and at the very least, disassemble and clean them.

New Brembo calipers for the 2012+ GSXR1000 can be had for $360 each.
 

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I hav 2000 2003 2005 zx12 forks. The inner tube dia on them all is 42.9mm.
I also hav 09 zx14 forks. The inner tube is also 42.9mm.
The caps on the 12 and 14 are different sizes. 51.xx vs. 49.xx.
But there is no real difference in internals as far as technology is concerned.
So using a good set of springs on the 12 internals,with a 14 lower seems reasonable.
To the naked eye the caliper mount on the 04-05 12 fork looks to be the same as a 14. Fender castings are in different places.
All my measurements should be verified before someone spends money. I just put a mic on the tubes for reference.

cmg
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks CMG. Have you had the 03 and 05 forks disassembled at the same time? I'm wondering if the bleed holes are located the same distance from the end of the tubes. I suspect they are the same and only have different part numbers because of the revised brake mount. Color variances from year to year will also have different part numbers even though they are the same otherwise. It sounds like the 14 went the way of the now-seemingly-standard 50mm/54mm outer tube diameters. If the internals of the 14 are the same, I don't see the need to do a moderately involved swap if a rebuild with 05 lower legs will be able to replace worn original components and add the benefit of radial brakes while retaining the original wheel, spacers, and fender. 5mm caliper spacers will be required to keep the standard 320mm rotors but those can be purchased for $40 (set of 4).
 

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I hav 2000 2003 2005 zx12 forks. The inner tube dia on them all is 42.9mm.
I also hav 09 zx14 forks. The inner tube is also 42.9mm.
The caps on the 12 and 14 are different sizes. 51.xx vs. 49.xx.
But there is no real difference in internals as far as technology is concerned.
So using a good set of springs on the 12 internals,with a 14 lower seems reasonable.
To the naked eye the caliper mount on the 04-05 12 fork looks to be the same as a 14. Fender castings are in different places.
All my measurements should be verified before someone spends money. I just put a mic on the tubes for reference.

cmg
Are the 14 and 12 inner tube lengths the same?
 

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Hi there,

What about fitting the later ZX-12R Radial Caliper/Wheel Mount to the early 00-03 (chrome) fork tubes.

The Caliper/Wheel Mount, will unscrew off of the chrome fork tube.

I used a ZZR1200 Bottom Yoke/Triple Tree, to hold my A1 12 fork tube

ZZR1200 Bottom Yoke/Triple Tree, remove steering stem, cut yoke in half through steering stem hole, a little filing, so the sides are flat and clamp in your vice.

There is a small grub screw, in the Caliper/Wheel Mount, that can be a problem to remove, the threaded hole is locked/'cross' drifted (you'll know what I mean when you look),
I applied heat with a oxy/acetelene torch (the painted doesn't burn off :headscratch:), and used the wheel spindle, clamped in the bottom to unscrew the mount.

Thanx Dave.


.
 

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Wasn't it somewhere on here the 14 and 12 forks and triples...the whole front end, was interchangeable? Just swap it at the neck and call it a day...all ya had ta do was change bearings or some shit....but otherwise they swapped right over....I'm sure it was a thread here....
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
.


Hi there,

What about fitting the later ZX-12R Radial Caliper/Wheel Mount to the early 00-03 (chrome) fork tubes.

The Caliper/Wheel Mount, will unscrew off of the chrome fork tube.

I used a ZZR1200 Bottom Yoke/Triple Tree, to hold my A1 12 fork tube

ZZR1200 Bottom Yoke/Triple Tree, remove steering stem, cut yoke in half through steering stem hole, a little filing, so the sides are flat and clamp in your vice.

There is a small grub screw, in the Caliper/Wheel Mount, that can be a problem to remove, the threaded hole is locked/'cross' drifted (you'll know what I mean when you look),
I applied heat with a oxy/acetelene torch (the painted doesn't burn off :headscratch:), and used the wheel spindle, clamped in the bottom to unscrew the mount.

Thanx Dave.


.
That was the thought as of post #5. If you need to replace worn, scratched, or pitted inner (43mm) tubes, instead of unthreading them and replacing them with standard chrome ones from Race Tech for $370 (for the pair), spend an extra $370 and get new OEM inner tubes (with the radial mount attached). Then either buy new or used radial calipers and some 5mm spacers and (maybe new brake lines too) you're done. New tubes AND radial brakes.
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Wasn't it somewhere on here the 14 and 12 forks and triples...the whole front end, was interchangeable? Just swap it at the neck and call it a day...all ya had ta do was change bearings or some shit....but otherwise they swapped right over....I'm sure it was a thread here....
It's a direct swap (for 02-05 bikes) if you get the entire 14 front end but it lessens the trail figure by around 3mm and can cause for some scary moments when the front is hovering just above the ground. The clamp to steering stem offset is what causes the alteration. The 14 clamps have the forks a little farther forward. The other downside is that if the internals of the 12 & 14 forks are the same, as cmg has mentioned, there is no benefit to using 14 forks other than obtaining the radial mounts and if you've already installed new springs and Gold Valves, as I have, you'd have to do it over again on the 14 forks. An inner tube swap is as easy as removing the bolt at the bottom of the leg and pulling the inner tube from the outer tube and swap it for the new tube, replace oil, done.

I read a post on here where someone put a 04/05 10R front end on their bike and said that it now has the rake and trail from the 10. This is innacurate. The rake is the steering head angle of the frame and is not altered unless raked triple clamps are use (I've only seen these used of choppers). The attached is an image of the 14 geometry. The clamp offset is easily found once we know the rake, trail, and tire OD. I'm not going to get into rear height effects or rasing or lowering the forks in the clamps--just the published data from the manufacturer.
 

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Imscared, did a 14 front end on his 12

But it wasn't that good in my opinion,

The handle bars were too close to the tank,

No turning circle.


Thanx Dave.


.
 

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Thanks CMG. Have you had the 03 and 05 forks disassembled at the same time? I'm wondering if the bleed holes are located the same distance from the end of the tubes. I suspect they are the same and only have different part numbers because of the revised brake mount. Color variances from year to year will also have different part numbers even though they are the same otherwise. It sounds like the 14 went the way of the now-seemingly-standard 50mm/54mm outer tube diameters. If the internals of the 14 are the same, I don't see the need to do a moderately involved swap if a rebuild with 05 lower legs will be able to replace worn original components and add the benefit of radial brakes while retaining the original wheel, spacers, and fender. 5mm caliper spacers will be required to keep the standard 320mm rotors but those can be purchased for $40 (set of 4).
Currently I have 03 internals in my 05 radial forks. Work perfect. So the oiling and valving are compatible.

cmg
 

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Hi there,

What about fitting the later ZX-12R Radial Caliper/Wheel Mount to the early 00-03 (chrome) fork tubes.

The Caliper/Wheel Mount, will unscrew off of the chrome fork tube.

I used a ZZR1200 Bottom Yoke/Triple Tree, to hold my A1 12 fork tube

ZZR1200 Bottom Yoke/Triple Tree, remove steering stem, cut yoke in half through steering stem hole, a little filing, so the sides are flat and clamp in your vice.

There is a small grub screw, in the Caliper/Wheel Mount, that can be a problem to remove, the threaded hole is locked/'cross' drifted (you'll know what I mean when you look),
I applied heat with a oxy/acetelene torch (the painted doesn't burn off :headscratch:), and used the wheel spindle, clamped in the bottom to unscrew the mount.

Thanx Dave.


.
Interesting.

cmg
 

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Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
all you'll need is sets of custom rotor and wheel spacers to make the swap complete.
I don't think the wheels or spacers are different between the 03 and 05 years and therefore the only difference is the rotor diameter. If using 5mm caliper spacers, the stock 320 rotors from the 02 & 03 bikes should work fine.

CMG, could you put a tape on the rotors of your 05 and post the out to out spacing of the rotors to verify they have the same dish dimension? As I noted in the BPF thread, my 02 measured just a hair over 5-15/16". If they are different, new rotors for an 04/05 will be required and thus, the caliper spacers won't be.
 
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