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Discussion Starter #1
Just to help understand:



This is how nitrous works with the stock computer.



If I told everyone my secrets you would not need me around anymore LOL.

The stock ecm on the 12 has approximately 25-35 pre programmed maps the factory won't tell us how many, for temperature ranges between 30 degrees and 120 degrees.



Throughout this band of maps are various combinations which also rely on a couple of other sensors. The air temperature sensor located in the airbox is a quick acting sensor which responds to outside temperatures. The block temperature sensor responds to coolant temperature in the block itself, both of these are combined at start up to provide a rich condition until everthing is at or close to running temperature. There are two atmospheric sensors one in the airbox and one in the rear tail, these compensate for the ram air application positive pressure in the airbox on the move and static pressure in the tail to add more fuel as the air demand increases.

This is basically how all the FI bikes are set up not exactly but close. By introducing nitrous into the air box lowering the temperature approx. 35-47 degrees increases the ecu pulse to the injectors or via the maps in the memory increasing fuel to the throttle bodies. The ecu in the 12 is a DFI but it is not programable on its own, thus the powercommander comes into play giving you the ability to make changes to the stock ecu but on a parametric level meaning if you make changes they are preset and change with regards to the stock sensors. This gives you the capability to make changes with programs for different setups much the same as your car. One step further the Muzzy box or the Yosh box are capable of multiple programs that can be switched rather than individually downloaded.

With this in mind there are limitations to the stock fuel rail capabilities and that is 250 hp, now if you can get a larger injector and better fuel pump which I believe Muzzy now has then you could be capable of more but it is my opinion that you will also have to beef up the bottom end as the rule of thumb for nitrous is 40% of the stock motor hp is the limit before upgrading internal parts.

I hope this helps out sorry if you felt like I was not answering your question I always get nervous when I say don't do that and someone still wants to, I have three 12s on nitrous and so far so good but I spent alot of dyno time and playing to try and make it safe. When you get to 40 hp that is the limit for pump gas yopu need to go to c-16 at this point and I recomend taking out 2 degrees of timing.

If there is anything else or something I didn't explain let me know I am more than willing to help.



Wayne (kingzx12r)





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What is the max safe limit for a single stage system?



If we have a PCIIIR, can we still have timing advance 4-5deg in the lower RPM and throttle position ranges and back it out to 0 advance above 75% throttle and 9k rpm? I am just thinking about the mid range power when not on NOS.



Thanks,





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Got my Hindle muffler today,Went to the track and kicked some ass but never got into the 8s.9.01 AT 155MPH.Easy,your making this more complicated than it is.Kings system is bolt on and go and your still safe with the 36 pill and 950lbs pressure.You probably aren't running any advance on your timing after mid range anyway but if you are i would just take that out and add a couple bars of fuel if you really want.I don't run a pc and with this pipe never will.

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Discussion Starter #9
oh oh your catching up to me Cowboy I think I need to make a third stage heehee.

So the Hindle is working good for you, have you had any slow criusing with it ?

Easy:

leave the timing alone timing advance + nitrous = no good

it is a blot on kit turn key pump gas go no need too make any adjustments.

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King,thanks for gettin me to wait for the new Hindle.I have had other pipes and they don't compare.The idle is too smooth it is unbelievable and there is no need to dyno to figure there is a difference in power.We get things sorted out and we're gunning for you.Thanks for everything.

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I was just hoping to have a little advance in the safe area's and then pull it out in the NOS areas. With the all around day to day non-NOS riding it is nice to have things tuned as well as possible.





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this may have been answered elsewhere, but here I go..

Can i add your system to my bike w. no other add on's?

ie: pc or yosh box, etc?

Mine is stock except for a slip on D+D pipe.

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Discussion Starter #15
Not king yet but darn close, don't forget you need the catylist out also I think most have it by now anyway.

If ou need the resistor email me I will send you the proper one.

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I am interested in your kit. could you e-mail me specs, cost,

etc , and how much airfare will be to get you to Dallas fo rthe install ?



Steve



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I know I'm not the KING yet,lol,but I did ask him this same ?before and the answer is yes you don't need a pc3.It is a good idea to put a resistor in your water temp sensor thow.

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most efi engines run a little lean (epa compliance)



by various means tuners/riders are able to induce

them to be rich +5%



i always thought nos needed an appropriate

amount of fuel to be effective....10, 15, 20%

more oxygen needs more fuel..... correct..??



the stock computer compensates that much...???



you are getting 35-40 hp reliably w/o the pcIIIr

could that be further improved .......

how much more with a pcIIIr at +5% &

no ignition advance( i know you say it will grenade)



curious & still learning

thanx

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