Info for standalone ECU

745 Views 13 Replies 3 Participants Last post by 1nfamous7, 16 d ago

1nfamous7

I'm planning on switching to a standalone ECU and need some info on the bike. I was curious wether the ZX12 has a CDI or if the CDI is in the coil?
Also curious of the dwell time of the coils and injectors as well as how many degrees relative to TDC the stock ignition timing is.
If anyone is aware also, I need to know what kind of sensor the crank and cam sensor is (hall effect or variable reluctance)
I'd also like to know if anyone has had their TB's bored with a stock cc setup or if I'll max out the stock injectors before I need to do that.

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bikerdude02

· #2 · 2 mo ago

The zx12r has an ECU, it's stand alone, under the compartment under the passenger seat.

I don't know the timing or coil questions or sensor type, might be in the manual. It's worth downloading.

Why do you want to bore out the throttle bodies? I highly doubt that these are the weak link with a stock setup.
I don't know the crossover point for the injectors, but my stock injectors were working well on a 1270cc tuned engine with a flowed head.

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1nfamous7

Discussion Starter · #3 · 2 mo ago

bikerdude02 said:
The zx12r has an ECU, it's stand alone, under the compartment under the passenger seat.

I don't know the timing or coil questions or sensor type, might be in the manual. It's worth downloading.

Why do you want to bore out the throttle bodies? I highly doubt that these are the weak link with a stock setup.
I don't know the crossover point for the injectors, but my stock injectors were working well on a 1270cc tuned engine with a flowed head.

The original fuelling system and its harness is being removed and replaced with a modern standalone ecu. I have done plenty of reading through the manual unfortunately the manual is for service only and not re-engineering the bike. I intend on getting the bike to run 200hp to the wheel and after some reading I heard that's what the stock injectors can max out at so I want some headroom. I am still not entirely sure wether I will bore it but there's going to be plenty of head work.

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bikerdude02

· #4 · 2 mo ago

1nfamous7 said:
The original fuelling system and its harness is being removed and replaced with a modern standalone ecu. I have done plenty of reading through the manual unfortunately the manual is for service only and not re-engineering the bike. I intend on getting the bike to run 200hp to the wheel and after some reading I heard that's what the stock injectors can max out at so I want some headroom. I am still not entirely sure wether I will bore it but there's going to be plenty of head work.

Nice. Re. injectors, a common theme is running zzr1400 injectors. They are the right diameter, but shorter. You can either skim down the mounting points on the fuel rail, or make top hat spacers to make them the same length. Plenty of people have done both. If you have a look through the forced induction section you should find some information.

As both crank and cam sensors are 2 wire, I suspect that they are variable reluctance. Not 100% guarenteed but fairly sure.

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1nfamous7

Discussion Starter · #5 · 2 mo ago

bikerdude02 said:
Nice. Re. injectors, a common theme is running zzr1400 injectors. They are the right diameter, but shorter. You can either skim down the mounting points on the fuel rail, or make top hat spacers to make them the same length. Plenty of people have done both. If you have a look through the forced induction section you should find some information.

As both crank and cam sensors are 2 wire, I suspect that they are variable reluctance. Not 100% guarenteed but fairly sure.

Thanks for the tips. I'll have to look into the zzr1400 injectors mounting and see which is better for atomization but this sounds like a better solution than what I was going to do, also more affordable.

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bikerdude02

· #6 · 2 mo ago

1nfamous7 said:
Thanks for the tips. I'll have to look into the zzr1400 injectors mounting and see which is better for atomization but this sounds like a better solution than what I was going to do, also more affordable.

Budget ZX12 turbo build

This guy has fitted the injectors. Apologies, ZX14, not ZZR1400 injectors.

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1nfamous7

Discussion Starter · #7 · 2 mo ago

bikerdude02 said:
Budget ZX12 turbo build

This guy has fitted the injectors. Apologies, ZX14, not ZZR1400 injectors.

I believe they should be the same like the zzr1100 and zx11.

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carlriddle

· #8 · 30 d ago

I’m running a ms3 ecu on my 12. It’s in off-road car.
garret gt25 turbo 450cc inj on e70 blend. Coils from an Audi (not 100%) sold on these yet. Still tuning. I found a map I believe from ridge runner. Stock timing wheel for now. Stock cam and crank sensor. Runs good not great yet some studders at 75%+ throttle.

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1nfamous7

Discussion Starter · #9 · 30 d ago

carlriddle said:
I’m running a ms3 ecu on my 12. It’s in off-road car.
garret gt25 turbo 450cc inj on e70 blend. Coils from an Audi (not 100%) sold on these yet. Still tuning. I found a map I believe from ridge runner. Stock timing wheel for now. Stock cam and crank sensor. Runs good not great yet some studders at 75%+ throttle.

Is that map from ridge racer for boosted bikes? Ofc the map will need to be tuned differently depending on turbo used, boost, fuel, etc. I have been leaning towards the Fueltech since an equivalent Motec setup is about 12k USD. I decided on trying to make a setup with a turbo that's rideable road racing so I will make the setup from scratch. I am not sure what is available on the MS3 regarding tuning functions but the standalone should allow you to control everything necesarry and receive proper inputs to make a stable map

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carlriddle

· #10 · 23 d ago

1nfamous7 said:
Is that map from ridge racer for boosted bikes? Ofc the map will need to be tuned differently depending on turbo used, boost, fuel, etc. I have been leaning towards the Fueltech since an equivalent Motec setup is about 12k USD. I decided on trying to make a setup with a turbo that's rideable road racing so I will make the setup from scratch. I am not sure what is available on the MS3 regarding tuning functions but the standalone should allow you to control everything necesarry and receive proper inputs to make a stable map

Was a stock time map Ive tweaked with some help
From others. Garrett gt25r bb turbo spins quick. Holding it to 10-12lbs boost. Still missing some snap I had w factory ecu w Bazzaz piggyback fueling. Needs more fuel timing mapping. Or a possible leak from wastegate or bov.

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1nfamous7

Discussion Starter · #11 · 23 d ago

carlriddle said:
Was a stock time map Ive tweaked with some help
From others. Garrett gt25r bb turbo spins quick. Holding it to 10-12lbs boost. Still missing some snap I had w factory ecu w Bazzaz piggyback fueling. Needs more fuel timing mapping. Or a possible leak from wastegate or bov.

I don't plan on exceeding 5psi, that GT25R might be a better option for me from what I read on the garret website. What kind of wastegate setup are you running? The wastegate setup does affect how rapidly boost is built as the most simple wastegate setups are always at least partially opened under boost. I'm not the best guy to talk to about turbos, that would be Scott, but I've heard 3 port solenoids can be setup to generate very good spool. When I setup the standalone ecu if enough people are interested I might do a write-up/guide. It's a pretty cool setup, its gonna replace the cluster with a digital touch dash that I can use to fully alter the map on the fly, no need to plug in laptop, i can get all my data from all sensors/inputs and fully adjust anything right there on the display🤯.

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carlriddle

· #12 · 16 d ago

Turbo has internal wastegate. Psi will jump to 10psi pretty quickly. But could be culprit?
I want a full digital dash. It’s in future. What are you thinking of using? Laptop fell out of rail and broke screen so turning got cut short.

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1nfamous7

Discussion Starter · #13 · 16 d ago

carlriddle said:
Turbo has internal wastegate. Psi will jump to 10psi pretty quickly. But could be culprit?
I want a full digital dash. It’s in future. What are you thinking of using? Laptop fell out of rail and broke screen so turning got cut short. View attachment 18214

The more air that's going though it, the more the spring will open on internal wastegate. I found this video the other day, very informative. Might be of use to you

it explains wastegate setups you could run.

I'm planning on using the FT600 from fueltech although you could use the 400 and 500 just fine if I'm not mistaken, I just have a lot of electronics and what not so I want the extra inputs. Theres some dude who turbocharged a yz450f and hes using an Ft400 if im not mistaken, he goes by streetsweepers10 and has a youtube and some videos of the build if you want to get an idea of how he did his setup. Lots of benefits to the Fuel tech also the price is EXCELENT for what you get, an equivalent Motec setup would run you about 12 grand with mil spec connectors lol. 2800~ish for the dash ecu and 20ft unterminated harness is hard to beat. You will have to get their CDI though. I believe it's the spark pro but I have to check my build sheet. On your vehicle making the harness should be easy work, much easier than the bike, just a little time consuming but still very straight forward, nothing a few beers and a weekend or two cant take care of. They sell a lot of neat stuff on their website too which I recomend browsing, including the mil spec connectors which I plan on using as I want my harness to be fully modular and race grade. If you would like they also give you the option of downloading their ecu software and you can prepare a base map before you even have their ecu by inputting some information about the engine (why I asked questions regarding the rotors, sensors, etc).

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1nfamous7

Discussion Starter · #14 · 16 d ago

FT600 EFI System

A FT600 is FuelTech’s most advanced engine control and monitoring system. It is an ECU, dashboard, data acquisition and power management system! FT600 Manual FTManager Software.

www.fueltech.net

FT550 EFI System

The FuelTech FT550 is the best ECU for projects that require more features, including GearController (power-shifts), built-in accelerometer (G-meter) and gyroscope; In addition to all PowerFT ECU line features such as sequential injection and ignition, O2 closed loop, active traction control...

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FT450 EFI System

The FuelTech FT450 is the perfect product for projects that require a great cost-benefit by enjoying all PowerFT line features like sequential injection and ignition, O2 closed loop, active traction control, integrated BoostController, internal datalogger, progressive and PRO-Nitrous controls...

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The 450 has to option of a universal 4 cylinder harness for $1600 USD

ECU Comparison Chart

Take a look at our ECU comparison chart to find out what ECU best fits your needs. Please don't hesitate to contact us if you have any questions. Click on the chart below to view an enlarged version.

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The chart above will let you compare the ECUs and make a choice based on what features you would like if you would like to use a fueltech. There is also the ft700 although the additional features it offers are oriented towards Profesional race teams.

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