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Discussion Starter #1
This is what I've come up with so far.



Prices:



Discountmotorcycleexhaust.com list a Sport Production system for $750. I don't get it. The Akropovic site doesn't list a Sport Production as being available for the ZX-12R. Neither does any other site that I've been to.



Parts411.com list the ZX12R 00-01 TITANIUM RACE for $990.



Of course spencercycle.com has the complete package deal

(Akrapovic Full Exhaust System, Power Commander 3R, K/N Air Filter) for $1282.00. It's unknown which full Akro system this combo deal includes. Anybody know?



Parts411.com price for a ZX12R RACE POWER COMMANDER 3R - $318



Parts411.com price for Yosh ZX12R EMS CONTROL KIT - $455



Muzzy ZX-12R REED CHAMBER BLOCK OFF PLATES - $35



I've talked to 3 Dynojet approved Tuning Centers. All have said that it's necessary to remove the Kleen air sytem to get a good custom map.



Parts411.com price for a K&N filter $82 (Wow! Ouch!)



Worst case scenario (omitting spencercycle deal) with Yosh EMS - $1562 no including taxes shipping and handling.



Worst case scenario (omitting spencercycle deal) with PCIIIr - $1425



Oh ya, I forgot dyno time to get a custom map done. So far the rates seem to average out to be $250.



If I want to get the pipe installed while I'm at it then tack on another $50 to $75 (rough estimate).



So what am I look at roughly? $1800? That's omitting the spencercycle deal. Getting the dyno work done etc. with the spencercycle deal pans out at around $1500 or so.



All I can say is ouch! That's a lot of $$$ to dish out for something that has no resale value (over time).



I was all set to just do a Bolt-On but after a few folks made comments about the flange its heighten my attention to it. Now it bothers me where I hardly noticed it before.



Thanks to the flange comments I'm now going back and forth like a pendulum on a cuckoo clock.



Still the Muzzy Ti Bolt-On, the most most expensive bolt-on that I've looked at, Only runs $517. That's a far cry from a full Akro setup. The Two Brother Racing Bolt-On is even less, but the flange issue is even more pronounced. Then again the Muzzy has a rep for being obnoxiously loud.



Of course somebody said to go for the full Akro system because it only cost a few hundred more than the bolt-on and I would regret not spending the extra few hundred if I didn't. Only and extra few hundred? Sure if you don't count the extras.



Oh,,, but that Akro Ti system looks so good. Crap....



Maybe some research into the Muzzy and Yosh systems is in order....



</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/utbbt.showPublicProfile?language=EN>TBBT</A> at: 5/1/02 3:54:42 pm
 

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Get the Full Akrapovic system and you will be far far ahead of the bolt on with less weight and tons more power.

If it was me I would go with the Akrapovic (best pipe at this time for the 12) or wait a bit and see how the stepped Hindle pipe works out.

The Muzzy idle can really tick you off, but some people like it.

A bolt on can actually cost you power.

Go with the Spencercycle deal, Doug is great and will treat you right. Your 12 will be a new animal when you are done.

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We ONLY sell the "RACE" Version of the Akrapovic Exhaust System for the ZX12r.



The "Sport" production WILL NOT make the same power and is built differently. As far as we know they are NOT available in the USA and was told the they are not made anylonger.



We get ALOT of calls from people that are being confused by the sites listing these pipes and the prices, They NEED to update their sites and info. The only thing that may be true is they STILL have some of these OLD systems in stock, BUT as far as we know they HAVE NOT been available for around 2 years now and WE NEVER were able to order ANY for the ZX12r to begin with.



Our prices ARE CHEAPER on that RACE exhaust.



Thanks

Doug

SpencerCYcle.com

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Go with the Akropovic and you WILL NOT be dissapointed. It is simply the BEST your money caqn buy!!

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"Speed costs money, son. How fast do you want to go?"



Its an old saying, but still true today.



Akra is the king of the pile for the 12.

"Warning: Objects in my mirror are disappearing much faster than you realize".</p>
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Ha! How fast do I want to go? I'm getting to be an old man. It's not so important to go fast. It's more important to know that you can :)



Hell this beast has enough power for me in stock form. I would just like to make it look better. Don't get me wrong I'll take the extra horses but they're not a priority.



I like this bike so well that whatever mods I make I want to do right. So, it's unlikely that I will go for cheap alternatives. Unfortunately I see my wallet becoming painfully lighter in the near future.



Doug - Expect another new customer in the near future. As soon as I get this move to Iowa ironed out and over with I'll be giving you a call.



Doug - Another question - Do you sell the Yosh EMS boxes?





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The Akra race system is a damn good choice, no doubt. But don't you believe for 1 minute that a Yoshimura RS-3 Duplex Race system isn't equal to the Akra on the street. The Yosh isn't excessively loud, will match the Akra for upper-rpm power and makes MORE power in the lower-midrange portion of the power curve.



Akra owners love Akra pipes! And with good reason - they ARE good systems. Do your research and you'll find the Yosh Race just as appealing - maybe even more appealing when you compare pricing.



Me? I'd be happy with either one!!

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Do it...get the full Akra system. I got mine from Doug...didn't really check around on prices. He had great customer service & I know that if I need to call him about something-

#1 - I'm talking to the man...not some dork that doesn't know shit (that's why Doug sells his as a package)

#2 - he's a biker...that means he's really interested not only in his job but more importantly that you are happy with your purchase.

#3 - even if you could buy the complete system from someone else for a few bucks more (I'm not sure if you can) but keep in mind the customer service side of things!!!



Bottom line...shit isn't cheap...guess that's why Ferrari's cost so much. Akra is the Ferrari of pipe's...you get what you pay for!

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Yosh makes a helluva good exhaust system. That is beyond argument.



I think there comes a point where you narrow down your choice to 3 or so, and then go with the one your gut tells you.



Also, some guys are brand loyal, and Yosh has a good name.



Before I bought my 12, I had never even heard of Akropovic.



After I studied and listened, I opened the wallet and went with Spencers Performance Pack. Akra SS Race header, Ti can, Muzzy block offs, and K&Ns, PC3R, etc....



If I was to start all over again tomorrow, I would not deviate from what I did on iota.



The Akra in my opinion is, bar none, the best pipe money can by for the 12.



Just one guys very biased opinion.

"Warning: Objects in my mirror are disappearing much faster than you realize".</p>
 

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Well.... I've got the Yosh! So, it could be argued that I'm biased, too!!



You really can't go wrong either way. The Yosh doesn't equal the the Akra on the Busa (and maybe other bikes as well?), but on the 12R the Yosh is a fantastic system. Fit, finish, looks and performance - the Yosh has it all!!



Oh... and Doug at Spencer Cycle sells the Yosh systems, too. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

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Discussion Starter #11
Since Doug sells the Yosh also, I may have to look into it... I've looked at the Yosh website, but they didn't have any good pictures.... If ya got pictures please post them....



I will say just on the looks end it will be hard to surpass the Akro.



I wasn't aware that there was torque advantage with the Yosh vs. the Akro in the lower/normal rev ranges... Wish I had some Dyno curves to look at....







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Well I have been doing alot of listening and research myself for the new 12.. (2 Days Left) and unless I hear something outstanding about the Akra then I will be going with the complete Yosh setup.



Yoshimura RS-3 Duplex Race, and EMS...



I just like the performance, fit and finish, and I want to use the Yosh maps to... <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> My experience with the Yosh in the past has been great, so im looking forward to seeing it on the 12.



Boostable

</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/uboostable.showPublicProfile?language=EN>Boostable</A> at: 5/1/02 6:08:35 pm
 
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I have the Yosh also and I am very happy with it. That deal from doug at spencers would be hard to pass up though. I paid 700, add the yosh box or a pc and you are to 1000 bucks without the filter or block off plates. I do like the looks of the yosh stainless that I got better than an akro but the akro is the best right now in terms of all out performance. My bike runs great without a pc, so until I see signs of leaness or my seat of the pants dyno tells me I need a little more it is going to stay the way it is.

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Then we agree. Yosh or Akra. Akra or Yosh.



Too bad we can't have more products in our lives where you really have to make a hard choice, eh?



- Blitz

"Warning: Objects in my mirror are disappearing much faster than you realize".</p>
 

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I have the Akro from spencercycle.com on my '02 and I LOVE it.



TAinui

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And not to belabor the point, but go back 10 posts, and note what Doug said:



"Researching a full Akropovic system.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Go with the Akropovic and you WILL NOT be dissapointed. It is simply the BEST your money caqn buy!! "





"Warning: Objects in my mirror are disappearing much faster than you realize".</p>
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Akro - Yosh? Yosh - Akro? I'm going to go crazy!!!! I may never make up my mind.... Hope I have one left after this.....



The only reason I may consider the Yosh is that I had a Yosh system on a ZX-10 many years ago and I liked it a lot. Especially the sound. It wasn't loud or obnoxius but still sounded good.



Still that Akro Race Ti system looks sweet. I wonder just how much difference in performance there is between the two.



I've heard that the Akro sounds similiar to Yosh. If so that's also a point in the plus column for the Akro. It's been a while since I've heard an Akro so I can't remember.





</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/utbbt.showPublicProfile?language=EN>TBBT</A> at: 5/1/02 6:22:15 pm
 

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Follow your gut bro, thats the best advice I can give you.



I'm sure they are both really good pipes.



The Akro is not objectionably loud, but it does have a pretty good bark above 6K.



I'm sure you'll be happy either way you go.



Peace, Blitz.

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At one time Muzzy was the chosen pipe for Team Kawasaki.

Then the wind changed and now the Akro is the exhaust system used by Team Kawasaki.

Having said this, if the Yosh is the best system available why is it not on the factory race bikes.

I personally have an Akro and will always lean towards it. But ask your self why the Akro is part of Team Green.

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We sell the yosh exhaust also. $710.00 plus s/h

The ems will run you $440.00 plus s/h



BOTH systems are good. I JUST prefer the Akra BECAUSE I HAVE one on MY personal bike (Busa--sorry guys) The pipe gave me a 16hp increase from stock with a PC2. The Akra on a ZX12r will net around 14-17hp with a pc installed.



The Akra IS our best seller for the zx12

Yosh is next followed by Muzzys.



Both sound vewry close to each other,but for fitment i would have to go with thAkra, NOW i have NOTHING against either of the systems in questions as I said BOTH are good and WILL make power.



I can tell you guys this. the Muzzy pipes seem to IDLE HUNT WAY to much,The Akrao DOES NOT. i do not know about the Yosh because all of our custormers except one has Akraos installed by us or sold to them by us.





Ineed to tell you guys that if you need to contact me this week, you should do it EARLY Friday. I and the rest of us are leaving for the Prostar race friday afternoon and will not return till Monday.





Thanks Doug

SpencerCycle.com







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